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Severus Snape v. The Ministry of Magic
by J.K. Rich
After reading Book Six in the Harry Potter saga, millions of Harry Potter fans were devastated to learn that after it all—after all the warnings and signs—Severus Snape is, in fact, evil. And, even more devastating—he had killed Professor Dumbledore right in front of The Boy That Lived. Or did he?
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Reader Comments: (Page 9)
Actually its not 'wind'. It is a 'rushing sound' as if something large were soaring through the air. I always thought of it as ' comes on swift wings'...
Given the original purpose of this entire site I had once listed every use of the AK curse. Dumbledore's is the only occasion where the deceased is moved significantly as well as not having the 'rushing sound'. The Fox, near Spinner's end moves a little, but Cedric and the spider in DADA class simply fall over without moving.
Even so... if JKR says that he is then she is the final arbiter of the discussion.
Posted by Charlie Tarbox from Gettysburg, Pa on May 10, 2007 4:00 PM
Per your comment regarding the AK curse you stated....
"Dumbledore's is the only occasion where the deceased is moved significantly as well as not having the 'rushing sound'. The Fox, near Spinner's end moves a little, but Cedric and the spider in DADA class simply fall over without moving."
Although you are correct, isn't it funny how Hollywood totally destroyed this theory? If I remember right Cedric did a full 360 in the air when Wormtail did the AK on him. Now that is some kind of power coming from Wormtail. Just think what Snape's or LV's should be like if Wormtail can make a young man do a 360 in the air.
Posted by Chris from Walla Walla on May 10, 2007 6:10 PM
I like the idea of Dumbledore time travelling, but JKR has said on her website in the Rumors section dated 06/04/05, that "NONE of the chatacters in the books has returned from the future." I suppose you could say anyone not properly introduced yet (Aberforth) is not included in this, but that might be pushing it.
Posted by mmc from sa on May 10, 2007 9:34 PM
Not pulling a Gandalf can also mean something completely different.
Gandalf, the Grey transformed into Gandalf, the White. What's the opposite of this? Dumbledore, the White transforms into Dumbledore, the Grey.
Aberforth Dumbledore would be a nice match for such a transformation.
Now we could speculate who and what Aberforth really is. There are a many possibilities. We all know that Albus has went back in time before, he said so in the Prisoner of Azkaban when he tells Harry/Hermione the basic rules of timetravel.
So Aberforth could be an Albus which went back in time and Albus/Aberforth is surely able to deal with the fact of 2 different versions. It could also explain that Aberforth stoped Severus to hear the full prophecy at the right time.
Another possibility is that Aberforth isn't Albus but a hidden character which place could be taken over by Albus now after his "".
Yet another possibility is that Albus is able to generate bos and control them as if they were other humans. Albus is an absolute master in transfiguration and as we've seen in the battle against Voldemort he can control several statues to do different things at the same time.
What do we know about Aberforth? We know he seems to be grumpy, not really social interactive and that he does repeative unnecessary glass cleaning which makes the glasses even dirtier.
It could indicate that he isn't fully aware of what he is doing which could mean that Albus doesn't always pay full attention. We also know that Albus jokes about improper usage of goats and that he doesn't know if Aberforth could read. Sounds like a real joke, but what if that's just a layer of the real truth? Aberforth could be a transfigured goat which is then controlled by Albus to do his bidding.
Posted by Ralph from Germany on May 11, 2007 08:47 AM
Heather from NJ,
At first I was shocked, couldn’t understand how JKR could have ed Dumbledore, then I thought there could be a way around it, but I am now convinced that Albus is .
We see him again through memories and other means, not in flesh and blood.
I miss him though.
Harry needs to stand on his own two feet. As long as Dumbledore was there, he would have been Harry’s guide and protector, now that he has left him, it is up to Harry to make his choices and face the consequences of his actions. Of course he have help, Hermione, Ron, Neville, Luna, Ginny and many others stand by him and may offer some guidance and protection, but Harry no longer view anybody as a kind of “parent”, as a guide and protector.
Posted by Emilio from Mexico City, Mexico on May 11, 2007 09:06 AM
To Ralph from Germany,
Firstly to be able to control the movements of statues, you would need the use of transfiguration, however to be able to control living creatures I am nearly sure that it would require dark magic. Even if Dumbledore is able of producing dark magic he would never use it in situations unless it was in great need.
I, however, do support the theory that Dumbledore left instructions with his brother Aberforth about what Harry should do next and whom he can trust and so on... the theory that dumbledore might have time travelled back might work as long as it wasnt done after the ending of the fifth book. Because in the beginning of the sixth book Hermione states that they had destroyed all the time turners in their adventure down in the department of mystery.
Posted by Yash on May 11, 2007 12:38 PM
Alas.. if only the films would follow the books. Are we to believe that Barty Crouch Jr is alive and fully functional because there is no dementor's kiss in the film? Are we to move a Patil to Griffindor because they cut that corner in the films? Do we erase Ludo Bagman from our memories?
If we are discussing the AK curse in HBP we can only rely on the 'cannon' as coming from the books I am afraid. Even if there is the 'foreshadowing' of plot from POA as a film (see other articles on this site for examples). The films simply have to stand on their own as they trim and rearrange characters and plot.
Posted by Charlie Tarbox from Gettysburg, Pa on May 11, 2007 3:56 PM
mmc: when Jo said none came from the future, she was answering a question about Harry's son being Dumbledore. To me, not coming back from the future means that none of the characters was born after the end of book 7. But people in HP do travel through time (Hermione and Harry).
Yash: of course, if Dumbledore intended to travel back (or if someone helped him in doing that), he would have kept a time-turner with him (maybe his swatch is a time-turner).
Posted by herve from strasbourg on May 11, 2007 11:42 PM
First of all I think you all have really good theories about Dumbledore and Snape, and I would like to post my view on that too.
Dumbledore (Albus) is , and not return from the , so I believe. But I also think that Snape is not resposible for Dumbledore to . In fact, I think Snape is a GOOD guy. I tell you why:
First of all, the scene in the forest actually is Snape confessing to Dumbledore about what he has to do (and I think he even suggests ing Dumbledore, even when his real task with Draco Malfoy was different), and normally you're not confiding in someone to him. Dumbledore at that time said he had to do it, but Snape didn't really want to. Secondly, at the tower scene, when Draco was confused, one of the Eaters could actually step in and Dumbledore, but before that could happen Snape intervened, plotting something in which Dumbledore could survive. Like many other readers I agree that the curse wasn't an AK curse, but perhaps he wanted to jinx Dumbledore so he would drop and be stunned, so it would look like an AK curse. Instead, Dumbledore must have foreseen this action, and decided to take matters in his own hands, to protect Snape's cover, to protect Harry Potter and perhaps also Draco (who would be punished perhaps for not doing the job). That's where Dumbledore decided to suicide by throwing himself out of the tower, in which the fall ed him. That's why Snape says: "DON'T!"(pause of disgust, after he quickly recovers again) "CALL ME A COWARD!"
The fact that Snape could Harry in the fight afterwards but didn't is also a sign that he's a good guy. And why would he hurry the Eaters out of Hogwarts, as they also could off the whole school? Because Snape is a good guy, and wants as little casualities as possible.
Posted by Lea de Weerd from Rotterdam, The Netherlands on May 12, 2007 12:18 AM
About the movies. Maybe JK did change the AK because it was in the movies, but then she would have changed all the other things too. It is curious, very curious.
Posted by Claudia on May 12, 2007 2:22 PM
I do believe that Dumbledore is and that it was Dumbledore who demanded that Snape do the deed if it became necessary. Why? To do for Hogwarts what Harry's mother did for him. In sacrificing himself he has but a magical protection upon Hogwarts. As Harry was protected by his mother's sacrifice of love, Dumbledore sacrifice of love protect Hogwarts from what ever Voldemort wants so bad from there. There was a reason he wanted to teach there so badly.
I also believe that even though Dumbledore is , there is a way for him to return. Not as a living being, but as a substitute. The portraits of the past Head Masters. They can communicate and travel from one portrait to the next of themselves. Would not Dumbledores portrait be place in many places and building in the wizarding world as a tribute. Could not Harry and the others communicate with him. I believe he would retain his vast knowledge of how to fight Voldemort. He may even be able to counsel Harry.
Posted by Linda from Kentucky on May 12, 2007 8:43 PM
When Dumbledore was flying towards the tower in the Lightning-Struck Tower chapter of the book, he was concentrated totally on the tower itself. (If you look back at the first book, Snape was constantly looking at Harry performing a counter-curse for the curse Quirrel was placing on Harry's broomstick at the time.)
Being the strong wizard that he is/was, Dumbledore wouldn't exactly need to say the incantation aloud if he was performing it, correct? Well the answer to that is yes. Wizards are capable of using spells without saying the words aloud. So could Dumbledore been performing some counter-curse? Or could he have sent Snape the Phoenix message to tell him to come up the stairs: In the book it refers to Snape's eyes switly looking around before seeing Dubmledore...then he looked aggressive.
About Dumbledore pleading Snape. I don't think Dumbledore was actually pleading for his life...He was actually pleading for Harry's life. Snape could put two and two together by seeing the two broomsticks.
My last point is the Avada Kedavra ing curse. In GoF the movie, Wormtail(using Voldemort's wand) s Cedric Diggory. -Reverse- At the front of the movie it shows Voldemort himself use the ing Curse on Frank Bryce. Now, i would say the s were certainly connected. HOWEVER since when have the AK curse ever threw someone off their feet? In the book 4 GoF Cedric simply slumped upon being hit with the curse...In book 6 HBP Dumbledore was bodily lifted and thrown threw a window. That doesn't sound to right to me, so my conclusion is that Dumbledore and Snape had some mutual agreement going on (much like the Unbreakable Vow.)
Posted by Dark Prophet on May 12, 2007 11:43 PM
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