Emmeline Vance: The Future Rosetta Stone
by Louis CasaBianca
Emmeline Vance appears in Order of the Phoenix for exactly 42 words, and yet she may very well be the key to understanding Snape, and therefore the key to understanding all seven books. First she's part of Harry Potter's guard on the way to 12 Grimauld Place. Next, in Half-Blood Prince, she's dead, killed around the corner from the Muggle Prime Minister's office.
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Reader Comments: (Page 2)
people, i don't really understand this article or the comment above very much ( if u can explain it in an easier way thanx but if u can't its ok with me).
by the way, this may not be useful but i think its better to search for things in "snape" not the charecter but the area in england because maybe there is something there that made JKR recognize it because she wouldn't search for areas just because of a name. anyway this is just a thought.
Posted by ahmed from manama, bahrain on December 27, 2006 05:31 AM
To simplify the article down into one sentence:
JK Rowling doesn't mention things accidentally, therefore, we can speculate on what significance the small character of Emmeline Vance could reveal in the larger picture of the story. Otherwise, why mention her at all?
Posted by Tim from Bloomington, IN on December 27, 2006 10:27 AM
And when Harry and Dumbledore are talking about latest events (when going to visit Slughorn), Dumbledore is very sorry about Bones' , but doesn't mention Vance at all.
Posted by annie from Finland on December 27, 2006 1:13 PM
What about Dedalus Diggle? He is mentioned three times in PS/SS. The first time he is mentioned is by McGonagall when she says he was probably responsible for the shooting stars. Then when Harry is going through the people that seem to know him (before he finds out he is a wizard), a man in a violet top hat bowed to him in a store (also mentioned here is a women dressed all in green who waved to him...Emmeline maybe?) Then Harry meets Diggle on his first trip to Diagon Alley and Harry says that he has seen him before (the violet top hat probably sticks in his memory).
After all this, we don't hear from Diggle again until Order of the Phoenix when he shows up with the advance guard. It could be a red herring, I know she loves to throw those out there, but maybe he means something to the final book too.
Posted by Lisa from Fayetteville, NC on December 27, 2006 6:49 PM
To lisa, i thought we read about diggle in the goblet of fire a couple of times, during the portkey with cedric and when they blamed harry for the evil mark.
P.S: thanx Tim for helping me understand the article better.
Posted by ahmed from manama, bahrain on December 28, 2006 02:14 AM
i just wrote a comment and i would like to apolegize because i made a mistake and thought that diggle was diggory. my fault.
Posted by ahmed from manama, bahrain on December 28, 2006 10:28 AM
This is what I've been saying (about Emmeline) ever since I finished HBP. No one has been with me on it though. Thanks for saying what I've been thinking.
Now if you could only get people to start considering that Dumbledore had James' cloak because he was giving it to Petunia to visit her sister (unbeknownst to Vernon!) Put it together with the creaky stair on Privet drive and you've got another possible piece of the ly hallows puzzle!
Posted by leah from nyc on December 28, 2006 9:49 PM
As much as I really admire the work put into the quoted passages.. I disagree with the result of the research.
However... This led me to re re re read the applicable sections. Suddenly, I think an even more telling clue came from it.
Ask yourselves this.. "Is the of E. Vance more or less important to Valdemort than Valdemort remaining alive?" Assuming you answer that keeping Voldemort alive is the imiportant action, then consider this. 1. Snape treats Dumbledor's curse damaged hand, and is informed of the nature/origin of the curse. This means that Snape knows that Dumbledore/the order are tracking down and destroying the Horcruxes. When he is listing those actions which make his the most loyal/important eater to Bellatrix he OMITS this important piece of information. Why?
Because Snape really is working with Dumbledore and has never told Voldemort that the Horcruxes are in danger nor that Dumbledore has captured/destroyed one of them.
Instead, Snape says he revealed E.Vance's location and led to her capture. I say 'says' because, in fact, Bella is unlikeley to have the status/courage to ASK Voldemort to check on Snape. Honestly, I believe that not only is Snape good, but that he did NOT actually lead to Vance's and this is proven by the fact that he takes no credit for warning Voldemort about the Horcruxes.
Posted by Charlie Tarbox from Gettysburg, Pa on December 29, 2006 2:25 PM
how do we know that sanpe knows that dumbledore is destroying the horcrux or even knows that voldemort has horcruxes?
Posted by ahmed from manama, bahrain on December 30, 2006 05:10 AM
We know this from the following: (references to American Edition)
1. pg 503 " had it not been...for my own prodigious s, and for Professor Snape's timely action when I returned to Hogwarts, desperately injured....
2. pg583 "Go and wake Severus...Tell him, what has happened and bring him to me"
3. 253 "Take this necklace to Professor Snape at once..."
When they are dealing with cursed items at Hogwarts it appears that clues for the cure come from the cursed item itself. Harry saves the necklace to take to Madam Pomfrey as necessary for a cure, but McGonnagal has it sent to Snape rather than Pomfrey actually.
When Dumbledore returned with the damaged hand he had Snape treat it and must have had to share the entire circumstances with Snape for treatment.
When Harry and Dumbledore return to Hogwarts Dumbledore instructs Harry to go to Snape and to TELL HIM WHAT HAS HAPPENED. This would include.. "The headmaster and I went to look for a Horcrux, it was guarded in the following way, Dumbledore drank the potion, he then had the following symptoms etc etc"
If Dumbledore wishes Snape to know what happened with the Locket defences he must also have wished Snape to know the details about the Ring and its defences. (which we do not know actually). McGonnigal also recognizes that the object should go to Snape for analysis.
We are, after all, dealing with clues here and not revealed truths. However, I believe that these clues were intended by JKR to show Snape's work for the Good Guys and not for Voldemort. There are other Snape clues, but they are not relevant to this thread.
Posted by Charlie Tarbox from Gettysburg, Pa on December 30, 2006 08:11 AM
I didn't put too much value on Snape's Emmeline Vance comment at the time, but notice he said '', not 'ed' or 'executed'. While I belong to the 'Snape is Bad' school (but beginning to change my opinion), Snape using the word '' sounds like he disapproved of it.
Posted by Linda from Fort Wayne, IN on December 30, 2006 12:29 PM
It's too bad we don't know what happened to Snape's mother, Eileen. It's possible for Eileen Snape to have divorce Tobias Snape or maybe he d. Emmeline Vance can be rearranged to Eileen McMaven; maybe Eileen Prince Snape remarried to someone named McMaven. I checked Google and McMaven is a real surname.
As for Snape turning her in to Voldemort, maybe he hated her for allowing his father to verbally abuse them, maybe she was already and wanted to for a good cause. It's a bit extreme but stranger things has happened....
Posted by Linda from Fort Wayne, IN on December 31, 2006 08:47 AM
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